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Starmer says ‘vast majority’ of sexual abuse cases do not involve ethnic minorities
Keir Starmer is starting his LBC phone-in. He is broadcasting from Hartlepool.
Nick Ferrari, the presenter, starts by asking about the Rishi Sunak announcement about grooming gangs.
Starmer says, on child exploitation, we should do anything possible.
He says, as DPP, he gave the green light to prosecute the Rochdale case. That involved Pakistani men, he points out.
On mandatory reporting, he says he called for that 10 years ago.
That is “a decade lost”, he says.
That is 10 years ago and this government has been in power now for 13 years. That is a decade lost and I think the prime minister and others have to really explain why they have wasted that decade.
On ethnicity, he says “the vast majority” of sexual abuse cases do not involve ethnic minorities.
It is right that ethnicity should not be a bar, and political correctness should not get in the way of prosecutions. But the vast majority of sexual abuse cases do not involved those of ethnic minorities and so I am all for clamping down on any kind of case, but if we are going to be serious we have to be honest about what the overlook is.
And he says it was really instructive for him, when his team asked him for permission to prosecute the Rochdale cases, one of the men they were prosecuting had been arrested but not charged some years before.
He asked why. And what he found was that good faith police officers, and good faith prosecutors, had made assumptions about the young girl victims. Because they had not reported the abuse early, and because they had gone back to the perpetrators, and because they had been drinking, it was assumed they would not be believed.
He says he insisted on a change in approach.
Key events
Starmer accuses Tories of ‘lost decade’ for child protection because they ignored mandatory reporting recommendation
There was more news than usual in today’s ‘Call Keir’ LBC phone-in. Here are the main lines.
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Keir Starmer accused the government of a “decade lost” for child protection, saying that the government is only now implementing something he proposed a decade ago. He was referring to a law saying professionals working with children should be under a legal obligation to report suspected abuse. The government says today it will implement this. Starmer called for this in 2013, after standing down as director of public prosecutions. (See 9.12am.)
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He implicitly criticised Rishi Sunak’s claim that “political correctness” is to blame for minority ethnic grooming gangs escaping prosecution, saying the “vast majority” of abuse cases do not involve ethnic minorities. (See 9.12am.)
At the moment we’ve just got a clumsy way of trying to see whether there’s some other offence. Make it a criminal offence and clamp down on it because it is shocking what happens with young children.
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He defended his statement in an interview at the weekend that 99.9% of women do not have a penis. The presenter, Nick Ferrari, said that meant one in a thousand, and that that was too high. Starmer said he was not making a precise, numerical claim. He said he was making the point that for the “vast, vast, vast majority’” of women gender is biological, but that he was also not prepared to ignore the fact that some people are trans. He said he was trying to set out “a common sense, respectable, tolerant position”. Starmer used the 99.9% figure in an interview with the Sunday Times published yesterday. In its report it said:
According to the 2021 census, 262,000 people in Britain — 0.5 per cent of the population — stated that their gender identity was different to their sex registered at birth. Of those, 48,000 — 0.1 per cent — identified as a trans woman.
As we go around the country campaigning, I talk to thousands and thousands and thousands of people and they want to talk to me about the cost of living crisis, they want to talk to me about the fact they can’t pay their bills, they want to know what they’re going to do about their council tax. Almost nobody, but nobody, is talking about trans issues. And I do sometimes just wonder why on earth we spend so much of our time discussing something which isn’t a feature at the dinner table or the kitchen table or the cafe table or the bar.
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He said Rosie Duffield, the Labour MP who says she has been marginalised in the party because she speaks up for women’s sex-based rights in the context of trans issues, was an “important voice” in the party. He denied a claim that he had not spoken to her since 2021.
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He said that “of course” Brexit was a factor in the delays experienced by travellers at Dover at the weekend. In an interview yesterday Suella Braverman, the home secretary, said Brexit was not an issue. But Starmer said:
Of course Brexit has had an impact. There are more checks to be done. That doesn’t mean that I am advocating a reversal of Brexit, I am not. I have always said there is no case now for going back in.
He said the government should “get a grip”. He said:
Once we left, it was obvious that what had to happen at the border would change.
Whichever way you voted that was obvious. Whichever way you voted you are entitled to have a government that recognises that and plans ahead.
Yet again we have got to the first big holiday of the year and we have got queues to the great frustration of many families trying to get out to have a well-earned holiday, and I think my message to the government, their message, would be get a grip.
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He said he did not regard Jeremy Corbyn as a friend. When it was put to him that he had described him as a friend in January 2020, Starmer said that was a reference to the fact that they had worked together. He said Corbyn was never a friend “in the sense that we used to visit each other or anything like that”.
We’ve seen the safety problems with these schemes. We need to look again at them in my view.
NSPCC warns against framing grooming gangs problem as ethnicity-based
The NSPCC and experts on grooming gangs have warned ministers against framing the issue as one based around ethnicity, warning this could hamper efforts to tackle a crime that a Home Office report said was carried out predominantly by white men, Peter Walker reports.
Schools in England brace for more strikes as NEU rejects pay offer
Parents in England face another wave of strikes and school closures after teachers belonging to the National Education Union decisively rejected the government’s pay offer, Richard Adams reports.
Q: Would Labour get rid of smart motorways?
Starmer says there are clearly safety problems with them, so Labour would look at this again, he says.
And that’s the end of the Q&A.
Starmer claims ‘almost nobody’ wants to talk about trans issues when he is out campaigning
Ferrari ends by asking Starmer about his comment at the weekend that 99.9% of women do not have a penis.
Q: Does that mean one woman in 1,000 has a penis?
Starmer says he does not want to get into a debate about numbers.
He says “biology matters”. Women have won many rights, and he does not want to see those rolled back, he says. He says his comment at the weekend was acknowleding that there are a small number of people who are transgender.
He says “almost nobody” asks about trans issues when he is out campaigning. He asks why the media spends so much time discussing a question that does not feature in ordinary conversations.
Q: When will Sue Gray start working for you?
Starmer says the committee deciding when she can start, the Advisory Committee on Business Appointments (Acoba), is still looking at that.
Starmer says grooming child to go into drug dealing should be specific offence
Starmer says grooming a child to go into drugs or gang related activitity should be a specific offence.
At the moment this has to be prosecuted under other offences, he says.
Q: Will you renationalise water companies?
Starmer says he has looked at this. But renationalisation would cost an awful lot of money. He says he would rather spend the money training doctors and nurses.
Starmer says he does not consider Corbyn to be a friend
Starmer says he has not talked to Jeremy Corbyn for two and a half years.
Q: Is he a friend?
Starmer says Corbyn is not a friend.
Q; You called him a friend?
Starmer says he worked with him as a colleague. But he was never a friend in the sense that they used to go and visit each other.
Asked about the delays at Dover, Starmer says the government should “get a grip”. He says it was obvious that border arrangements would change after Brexit, and he says they should have planned for this.
Starmer says the decision to deny Charles Bronson parole was right.
Asked if the double child killer Colin Pitchfork should get parole, Starmer says he does not know the circumstances, but he does not think he should be released.
And asked if Levi Bellfied should be allowed to marry in jail, Starmer says he prosecuted Bellfied and has no sympathy for him at all.
Starmer says the children most likely to end up in jail are children who have problems in primary school, and then get excluded at secondary school. He says the government should be focusing on this group, to stop them offending in the first place. That is why initiatives like Sure Start from the last Labour government were so important.
Starmer says it is “shocking” that, for every 100 cases of sexual violence against women, only 1.6 gets prosecuted. He says when he first heard the figure, he had to ask his team to check it because he found it hard to believe it was true.
Q: Rosie Duffield says you have not spoken to her since 2021. Shouldn’t you be supporter her given the abuse she has faced.
Starmer says that comment was from a few weeks ago. He spoke to her recently, he says. He says she is an important voice in the party.
Q: She complained you did not notify her when you visited Kent recently?
Starmer says it is normal to notify the constituency MP, but not MPs from the county.
Nick Ferrari says NEU members have voted by 98% to reject the government’s pay deal.
Starmer says he is “disappointed” because he wants this to be resolved. He urges both sides to compromise.
Q: Do you supporter teachers going on strike during the exam period?
Starmer says he supporters their right to go on strike. But he does not want to see the strike go ahead.
Starmer says he cannot commit to giving junior doctors a 35% pay rise.
A caller tells him junior doctors stack up so much debt as they are training it is no longer a sensible career choice.
Starmer accepts that this is an issue.
Starmer says ‘vast majority’ of sexual abuse cases do not involve ethnic minorities
Keir Starmer is starting his LBC phone-in. He is broadcasting from Hartlepool.
Nick Ferrari, the presenter, starts by asking about the Rishi Sunak announcement about grooming gangs.
Starmer says, on child exploitation, we should do anything possible.
He says, as DPP, he gave the green light to prosecute the Rochdale case. That involved Pakistani men, he points out.
On mandatory reporting, he says he called for that 10 years ago.
That is “a decade lost”, he says.
That is 10 years ago and this government has been in power now for 13 years. That is a decade lost and I think the prime minister and others have to really explain why they have wasted that decade.
On ethnicity, he says “the vast majority” of sexual abuse cases do not involve ethnic minorities.
It is right that ethnicity should not be a bar, and political correctness should not get in the way of prosecutions. But the vast majority of sexual abuse cases do not involved those of ethnic minorities and so I am all for clamping down on any kind of case, but if we are going to be serious we have to be honest about what the overlook is.
And he says it was really instructive for him, when his team asked him for permission to prosecute the Rochdale cases, one of the men they were prosecuting had been arrested but not charged some years before.
He asked why. And what he found was that good faith police officers, and good faith prosecutors, had made assumptions about the young girl victims. Because they had not reported the abuse early, and because they had gone back to the perpetrators, and because they had been drinking, it was assumed they would not be believed.
He says he insisted on a change in approach.
Labour calls for ‘serious strategy’ on grooming gangs after Sunak claims ‘political correctness’ part of problem
Good morning. Rishi Sunak is today announcing a crackdown on grooming gangs. He is announcing a “grooming gangs taskforce” which will see “specialist officers parachuted in to assist police forces with live child sexual exploitation and grooming investigations to bring more of these despicable criminals to justice”, according to the No 10 news release. But Sunak is also presenting this as a crackdown on “political correctness” because, as Pippa Crerar reports in her story, he also claims this is a threat to women and girls too. In a statement issued overnight Sunak says:
The safety of women and girls is paramount. For too long, political correctness has stopped us from weeding out vile criminals who prey on children and young women. We will stop at nothing to stamp out these dangerous gangs.
Yvette Cooper, the shadow home secretary, has been giving interviews this morning, and she told the Today programme that Sunak’s announcement did not amount to a serious strategy. She said:
I think what is happening is the government is trying to distract everybody from focusing on the issues and the policies.
If they were serious about tackling child abuse and tackling child sexual exploitation, why are they cutting support for taking action on trafficking? Why are they not having proper support for victims?
This isn’t a serious strategy to take action, and we need a serious strategy because this is one of the most serious crimes of all.
We will hear from Keir Starmer himself on this shortly.
Here is the agenda for the day.
9am: The National Education Union announces the result of its latest strike ballot.
9am: Keir Starmer holds a ‘Call Keir’ phone-in on LBC.
11.30am: Downing Street holds a lobby briefing.
Sunak and Starmer are both doing visits this morning, in Leeds and Hartlepool respectively, so we will be hearing more from them too.
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